Ball python keeps getting under newspaper and thawing question

[Plumsmuggler]

Hello all,
I really appreciate the help I get from this website and quick responses I received last time I made a post about my bps ambient temps. The issue I am having is that my bp continues to get under the newspaper and lay on the plastic at the bottom of her tub. The UTH is of course on the otherside of the plastic and not directly in her tub. This is concerning to me because it is set at 88 degrees and usually warms up the newspaper to around that 88-92 temp range. I have a space heater close to her cage which keeps the ambient temps in the low 80s. If she lays directly on the plastic the temps fluctuate much more and I fear get too warm for her 95 temp range or sometimes more. She is a 500gram bp in a 18 quart tub. I am planning on upgrading her to a new larger tub soon. Her cage has a plastic black hide box, a small hide, and a water dish.
My question is how do you prevent them from getting under the newspaper? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Also I had questions about thawing. She has been an extremely consistent feeder, and has now just recently started turning down rats. Last time she tried to eat she struck at the rat missed got scared and had no interest in eating after that.
My typical routine for heating her rats has been let the rat thaw next to her cage for 2-3 hours, and then put it in the hottest tap water I can get for 10-15 minutes and then dunk the head to get the temps up. She does not seem to take the rat if the entire thing is drenched, which I try to prevent happening but sometimes water still manages to get into the bag. Should I try double bagging? Any thoughts or suggestions would be greatly appreciated for both of these questions.
Thank you!

[Ax01]

BP's will burrow in substrate like aspen, coco husks, etc. and will burrow in paper substrate (get under paper towels or newspaper) as well when they want. or it may be a security and hide issue. are your hides correctly sized? also if you're if you're worried about the temps, lower the setting on your thermostat.

u can use a blow dryer to finish off heating your rats. it will dry and heat it at the same time.

[dakski]

Hello all,
I really appreciate the help I get from this website and quick responses I received last time I made a post about my bps ambient temps. The issue I am having is that my bp continues to get under the newspaper and lay on the plastic at the bottom of her tub. The UTH is of course on the otherside of the plastic and not directly in her tub. This is concerning to me because it is set at 88 degrees and usually warms up the newspaper to around that 88-92 temp range. I have a space heater close to her cage which keeps the ambient temps in the low 80s. If she lays directly on the plastic the temps fluctuate much more and I fear get too warm for her 95 temp range or sometimes more. She is a 500gram bp in a 18 quart tub. I am planning on upgrading her to a new larger tub soon. Her cage has a plastic black hide box, a small hide, and a water dish.
My question is how do you prevent them from getting under the newspaper? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Also I had questions about thawing. She has been an extremely consistent feeder, and has now just recently started turning down rats. Last time she tried to eat she struck at the rat missed got scared and had no interest in eating after that.
My typical routine for heating her rats has been let the rat thaw next to her cage for 2-3 hours, and then put it in the hottest tap water I can get for 10-15 minutes and then dunk the head to get the temps up. She does not seem to take the rat if the entire thing is drenched, which I try to prevent happening but sometimes water still manages to get into the bag. Should I try double bagging? Any thoughts or suggestions would be greatly appreciated for both of these questions.
Thank you!

A couple quick thoughts.

1. BP's like to borough. I wouldn't worry about that. Like Ax01 said, make sure you have enough, and properly sized, hides. I use printless newspaper and sometimes my BP gets under it. My BP hasn't lately as I filled her 6X2' tank with hides. Most of the time, she is one of those, sometimes under the paper, and sometimes both! Important to have hides, preferably the same size, on warm and cool side, if not more if there is a lot of room in the tank.

2. Keep temps under 90F on the hot side. Thermostat probes will often not indicate the ground temp. Use a temp gun to get a proper temp reading at the ground and adjust accordingly.

It might be 88F at thermostat probe, but 92F at the ground. Lower the thermostat 1F degree at time until you get the temps you want.

3. At her weight, I wouldn't worry about her refusing food. How often and what are you feeding (weaned rat, small rats, etc)? BP's are known to fast at times, and this could be totally normal, and she might want to be fed either smaller meals, or less often. I feed my adult BP every two weeks because if I offer every week, she often refuses, or eats for 3 weeks, and then doesn't for 3 weeks, etc. She, unless in a winter fast, eats like clockwork every two weeks.

4. Ok to defrost at room temp for a while. I use room temp water, but that's me. However, BP's want raw food, not cooked food. A rat, especially a small one, will start cooking even in hot tap water 120-130F for 10-15 minutes. That could lead to refusal and also isn't great for the snake's digestion and health either.

Then, when totally defrosted, drop in hot tap water for 30-60 seconds. This will thoroughly warm the rodent. Then dry quickly with a paper towel and offer immediately.

Others use hairdryers to warm up the rodent. That works too. I find it quicker and easier, and have had better luck, with the quick hot water bath (again hot tap water - nowhere near boiling etc.).

Good luck and keep us in the loop.

[gusanr14]

I am currently using paper towel and substrate. Never seen or attempted to get under it. Ofc they will burrow if they want to but I have two snug fit hides in their and they just love those. Even if there is a way to go under paper towel, they don't even try.

[Plumsmuggler]

Thank you.
She definitely does not fill up her hide box. Maybe a little more than half of it if she is all coiled up. I was wondering if it was a security issue as well. Should I perhaps try putting a newspaper or paper towel in her hide box to make her feel more snug? I have lowered her temps a bit. I have a jumpstart thermostat and it seems like if I lower it a degree it gets too low like 84-85 range. I just purchased a 40qt tub, I know thats a big jump but I think she will transition well to it. I want her to eat before I make that change though so she has time to adjust to her new home.

[gusanr14]

Thank you.
She definitely does not fill up her hide box. Maybe a little more than half of it if she is all coiled up. I was wondering if it was a security issue as well. Should I perhaps try putting a newspaper or paper towel in her hide box to make her feel more snug? I have lowered her temps a bit. I have a jumpstart thermostat and it seems like if I lower it a degree it gets too low like 84-85 range. I just purchased a 40qt tub, I know thats a big jump but I think she will transition well to it. I want her to eat before I make that change though so she has time to adjust to her new home.

I heard putting something to fill up the hide box helps if it is too big for her. It could be a big jump but as long as you provide her with enough places to hide along the tub, that shouldn't be a problem. If there are too much spaces in tub, maybe more than 2 hides could be needed.
I think jump start thermostat do fluctuate based on my experience and others but not a big problem using it. Recently changed to herpstat 1 and it is a different world. It stays within the perfect range I set to. They got some cheaper proportional herpstat too. But jump start works too so your choice!

[Plumsmuggler]

I think my hide may be to big. In my 18 quart tub it takes up about half the tub. Which makes the cool side hide much smaller and she doesn't use it much. I think making the transition to a larger cage, will be useful in providing her with two different equal sized hides. I do use a temp gun and if she stays on top of the newspaper it is always below 90 degrees.
I was feeding her every 5 days and about 10% of her body weight. She has been on weaned rats up until this point and her next meal will be 60 gram small rat. It will be 10 days tomorrow since she has eaten last though. I figured tomorrow might be a good time to try unless you recommend waiting longer. I did have her out briefly earlier and her tongue was flickering pretty consistently so I assume she might be ready. Since she did have such a consistent feeding schedule I suppose waiting an extra 4 days (so its been 14 days since she ate) probably couldn't hurt. Interesting I will consider bumping her up to two weeks depending on how she responds to the 60 g small rat.
That's a good point perhaps the water is too warm and its partially cooking the rat. I did try the blow dryer method last, but I think I will try the first method you stated first.
I will consider using paper towels instead and see if that helps.
Thanks for all the help, and any more suggestions or changes I should make to my husbandry feel free to share!