Need to vent....

[Craiga 01453]

I have a hard time with anybody being ill prepared when bringing their new animals home. The internet is LITERALLY at almost everybody's fingertips, as I type this on my phone. It takes a matter of SECONDS to do at least a quick internet search. There really is no excuse anymore for not be prepared and properly educated before bringing a LIVING being home.

I can't understand how people can say things like "I went in for dog food and came out with a snake". I mean, it's not the same as going to Wal-Mart for a few odds and ends and walking out with a tv. And then they wonder "why is my snake not eating?" or "why does my snake look skinny?" after taking the word of an under qualified employee. Really? You just listen to what one person says and take that as gospel?

Bottom line: the responsibility belongs to the person bringing the animal home.

And to follow up on cchardwick's point about newbies being surprised by the size of prey a snake can eat...yes it's surprising and awe-inspiring. But again, in today's day and age, it's easy enough to Google or watch on YouTube and see before buying.

[zina10]

There is nothing wrong with starting a hatchling on rats right away..if they take it !! A rat pink is far bigger then a mouse pink.

So I can absolutely see a breeder feeding rat pinks/fuzzies to a BP hatchling.

We hear of buyers that have several months old BP's complain of them not growing. When asked, they feed food that is MUCH to small. Saying something like "the breeder told me it was feeding on rat pinks/fuzzies, mouse hoppers". Well, that is probably because the hatchling WAS feeding on that, and quite appropriately so at that time.

Perhaps those breeders/sellers didn't go on to mention that you have to actually GO UP in size as time goes by and weight goes up. Honestly, when I placed my hatchlings I made sure to mention (and I give out records) what they are feeding on, but I'm not sure if I actually told buyers to go up in food size eventually. I guess I just assumed they knew that. I did ask a few questions and I got a "feel" for the buyers/takers and none were "total" beginners, though.

So while I feel there should be some responsibility with the breeder/seller, there should also absolutely be responsibility with the buyer !!! At the very least, you should know the very basic requirements of the animal you buy/take.

That said, I would never "shame" a newbie coming here and asking for info/help. At least they are here trying to find out what they did wrong. For every one that does come here and ask for help, there are probably 50 others that just keep on neglecting their snake. True, they should have learned those facts beforehand, but then again, better late then never..

[Sunnieskys]

I breed Rats so if i have to many and need to downsize I give my big girl 3-4 weaned each week instead of a bigger one.. Nothing wrong with that at all.. Every couple months I do that for a couple week to keep the population down.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

No I get that too. And I do that at work if I run out of adult mice i weigh hoppers to equal an adult mouse weight so they still get the correct amount.

[Sunnieskys]

I'm not shaming the new beep owners. They are here to learn and we help them. When I brought home boople I knew what her weight was at, and what she was currently eating whether it was live or frozen. I would not have got her if she was on live. I didn't want that problem. These are basic knowledge everyone should have. I'm going to print the feeding charts and hand them out to new snake owners at work.

[artgecko]

I've only had one instance of purchasing a snake that was "maintanance fed". The seller didn't state that, but when I got the snake (a CA motley male boa) he was very lean...and not "loaf shaped" like boas should be. He also had muscle weakness as well, which I attributed to a combination of too little food, probably very small tub size, and his motley mutation which some breeders told me can prevent the snake from holding muscle tone as well.

Other than that, all the snakes I've purchased have been on appropriately sized feeders and appeared to be of a healthy weight.

I think that a lot of the responsibility falls on the buyer. I know that when I purchased my first snake, I asked not only what it was feeding on, but what the next size up would be, etc. I would agree with an earlier post that many times the breeder just assumes that you will know when to upgrade in feeder size.

When I breed, I plan on typing up a general care guidelines sheet and list things like feeder size and places to order feeders from, etc. Although that may be overkill, I think it would be helpful to send it to new buyers in email or folded inside the shipping box.

[Aedryan Methyus]

I will finally be receiving my new pair of 25% Kalatoa Super Dwarf Retics tomorrow morning and I asked the breeder what size prey they're currently eating. He said they are currently eating rat pups or small mice and these guys will be 1 year old in April and May and I can tell from the photos he sent me that they are very skinny. I want to try to keep their sizes manageable, but at the same time I don't want them to be skinny and I really don't want it to take 4 more years to get them up to breeding size, so i'm definitely going to have to be making some prey size and feeding schedule decisions...

[Sunnieskys]

I would ask why he is under feeding them?

[artgecko]

I will finally be receiving my new pair of 25% Kalatoa Super Dwarf Retics tomorrow morning and I asked the breeder what size prey they're currently eating. He said they are currently eating rat pups or small mice and these guys will be 1 year old in April and May and I can tell from the photos he sent me that they are very skinny. I want to try to keep their sizes manageable, but at the same time I don't want them to be skinny and I really don't want it to take 4 more years to get them up to breeding size, so i'm definitely going to have to be making some prey size and feeding schedule decisions...

Hmm.. I'd say they should probably be on the same feeding routine as their mainland cousins, just smaller prey (similar in width to body girth). I think young retics typically eat every 5-7 days.

I think many of the people breeding SD/ D retics under-feed to keep them smaller longer. I know there are some people that say to do the same with mainlands. IMO, that is just cruelty when done to keep the snake smaller in size. Plus, many retics will push and ruin their faces when not fed properly.

I hope you can get them well-started and on a correct feeding schedule. I'd also be interested in asking the breeder why he is under-feeding. :/ I think with my CA motley male boa, he was underfed to use less food / $$ and be kept in a smaller tub size until sold.

[Stewart_Reptiles]

What? You have to feed them?

Food is always the number one issue and has been for the past 12 years I have been on here, from not eating to too small, to too big and it comes down to RESEARCH, I understand you can't know everything but those to me are the basic requirements when it comes to buying a new animal, sadly if people do not research a dog breed and see if it is suited for them are they really gonna research snakes and proper diet and understanding of metabolism

Some people do those research but do them in the wrong places (like pet stores) or Facebook, sometimes you just have to question everything , and pick the brain of people that you know have experience.

Maintenance feeding is not new either especially from large scale breeders, I can say that every animal I bought from a large scale breeder was maintenance fed and small compare to stuff I produce that were younger (and I do not overfeed because I do not believe in getting them big as fast as possible either).......I have said it before there is a just a middle.

Anyway same problem it was a decade ago and it will continue when really all you have to do is reach out to a breeder or someone with knowledge (not all will answer but some will) and pick their brain.

[wolfy-hound]

I start my BP hatchlings on rat pinks. I think they put out a great heat signature, they wriggle in a nonthreatening way and I rarely ever have to offer anything else for the first two feedings to get hatchlings to eat.

Of course you'd move up in size but also remember that a new owner often mis-hears stuff or asked someone else, or thought "mice" instead of "rat". Or the breeder didn't want the new owner to over feed the snake to begin with, and recommended a smaller size. Or what a breeder considers a 'weanling' is smaller or larger than what someone else considers a "weanling" and so on.

Sure, in a lot of cases, it's literally a lack of research or a seller telling the owner a small prey item because they maintenance feed. But it's not always. The people who owned one of my monitor lizards were feeding him a hopper mouse once a week because way back 7 years before when they got him, they were told he should eat a hopper mouse.