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  1. #1
    Registered User jmcrook's Avatar
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    Gerald Super Dwarf Ultra Ivory Retic Progression

    Without further ado, Gerald!
    Gerald arrived this morning at about 9:30 in great shape. He was bred by Bob Clark from an ultra ivory anerytheristic male 6' and a fire het anery female 11'. 50% super dwarf blood hApPiE bUrPhDaEy!and 50% Thailand mainland blood and 100% het anery. Hatched on 3/15/16 and two and a half weeks from his 1st birthday he's currently about 3.5'... and very fast and squirrelly/flighty. I don't imagine he's had a lot of one on one time aside from cleanings at Bob's facility.



    Already off to a very inquisitive and rambunctious start. Pushing at everything in the cage as we speak. Took an enormous piss about 30-40 seconds out of the bag haha! Was told he was feeding on rat pups every 7-10 days but definitely looks like he could take down a small rat easily. I will be trying Gio's maintenance feeding approach in hopes of keeping his size in check. I'm guessing anywhere from 6-9' adult potential size and Bob told me that sounded about right.


    His colors and super minimal pattern are absolutely stunning in person. Curious and excited to see how his color develops as he ages. They often get some really beautiful grey freckling and darkening yellows.
    Has a very slight pushing scrape on his bottom lip that is barely visible here. I may offer him food sooner than the one week settling in time to keep him from pushing too wildly but we'll just have to see how he settles in for a couple days. He's finally quit pacing the cage and coiled in his warm side hide for the moment. Such an amazing looking animal.
    My friend who's been breeding reptiles of all sorts from mainland retics to albino diamond back rattlers for 25 years recently got a pair of adult 100% super dwarf females that were bred from his original wild caught bloodline that he sold several years back. I think we're planning to breed Gerald to them next season which would produce 75% super dwarf offspring all platinum/fire and 50% possible het anery.
    Thanks for looking!



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    Last edited by jmcrook; 02-24-2017 at 03:10 PM.

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  3. #2
    Registered User ShaneSilva's Avatar
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    Wow good looking snake! Interesting to see him grow would love to see him as an adult. Good luck with the breeding project


    Wooohoo more retics!!
    Last edited by ShaneSilva; 02-24-2017 at 03:21 PM.
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  5. #3
    BPnet Veteran Sauzo's Avatar
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    All you guys with your starving feeding schedules!!! Feed the snakes!!! They are retics and they eat. Don't try and keep it small by underfeeding it!! Buy a male Hognose if you wanted a small snake!!! My god!!! And it's worth testing out his food drive. Caesar ate about 2 hours after being here and hasn't stopped lol.

    A 3.5' eating rat pups seems kind of small. I would imagine Bob had him on minimal feeding size and schedule as breeders want to keep them small as long as possible so they are easier to sell. Plus it cuts down on his overhead cost for food. At 3.5' Caesar was easily pounding small rats. Heck, Kris was feeding him small rats at just over 2' when I got him.

    Awesome snake though. Be interesting to see what yellowing and patterning he develops with age.
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  7. #4
    Registered User jmcrook's Avatar
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    Re: Gerald Super Dwarf Ultra Ivory Retic Progression

    Quote Originally Posted by Sauzo View Post
    All you guys with your starving feeding schedules!!! Feed the snakes!!! They are retics and they eat. Don't try and keep it small by underfeeding it!! Buy a male Hognose if you wanted a small snake!!! My god!!! And it's worth testing out his food drive. Caesar ate about 2 hours after being here and hasn't stopped lol.

    A 3.5' eating rat pups seems kind of small. I would imagine Bob had him on minimal feeding size and schedule as breeders want to keep them small as long as possible so they are easier to sell. Plus it cuts down on his overhead cost for food. At 3.5' Caesar was easily pounding small rats. Heck, Kris was feeding him small rats at just over 2' when I got him.

    Awesome snake though. Be interesting to see what yellowing and patterning he develops with age.
    Oh wow, Caesar fed after two hours?! I may give Gerald a meal in that case. I've got a few small rats in the freezer that Geoffrey obviously won't have any interest in eating until probably April haha. I'll post more pics when I feed him.
    And yes, I'm sure Bob kept him on pups for the last year to keep feeding overhead costs low and keep him small. I'm just not going to offer him food every 4-5 days like I did with Phyllis when she was a hatchling. Gerald has great muscle tone and proportions for his short length and I'm in no hurry for him to get huge or obese.


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  9. #5
    Registered User jmcrook's Avatar
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    Re: Gerald Super Dwarf Ultra Ivory Retic Progression

    Quote Originally Posted by jmcrook View Post
    50% super dwarf blood hApPiE bUrPhDaEy!and 50% Thailand mainland blood and 100% het anery.
    Not sure how that hApPiE bUrPhDaEy snuck in there hah. Must have had that copied on my phone from texting to a couple friends recently and accidentally pasted it in here and didn't notice



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  10. #6
    BPnet Veteran Sauzo's Avatar
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    Yeah Caesar ate quick lol. He also wanted shy. When I pulled him out of the bag, he just sat there checking me out and the area. So yeah, he never was a shy one. Oh yeah, I doubt I would feed him every 4-5 days. I feed Caesar every 7-10 days but honestly, it really boils down to him as he lets me know when he's hungry by cruising around and pushing at stuff. It's pretty much the same with all the snakes. When they get hungry, they start cruising around and climb on their shelves and overall are busy. Once full and content, they either ball up and relax or stretch out and relax lol.
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  12. #7
    BPnet Veteran Sauzo's Avatar
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    Re: Gerald Super Dwarf Ultra Ivory Retic Progression

    Quote Originally Posted by jmcrook View Post
    Not sure how that hApPiE bUrPhDaEy snuck in there hah. Must have had that copied on my phone from texting to a couple friends recently and accidentally pasted it in here and didn't notice



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    Haha I saw that and just figured you had some weird form of Tourets so I wasn't going to point it out
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  14. #8
    BPnet Veteran CloudtheBoa's Avatar
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    Gerald Super Dwarf Ultra Ivory Retic Progression

    A SD retic will stay small no matter how you feed it, if you have to underfeed it to keep it small it's likely going to get bigger than you want.

    I'll have to disagree that the schedule Gerald was on was starving though. Not every snake is a hunger-crazed beast like Caesar, and they grow just fine being fed in that manner. Lol River was 3' even when I got her and I fed her rat pups until she was at least 4'. She grew 1.5' in 6 months eating that way, went from 3' at 6 months to 4.5' at a year. I did up her feeding through most of her second year, but ended up having to reduce the prey size as the bigger prey seemed to weigh her down. She easily took prey 15-25% of her weight as a baby, once she got on rabbits it had to be brought back down to 10-15%. Rats don't weigh her down as much but she does still get lazy the first few days on a colossal.

    Also I love the ultra ivories, and Gerald is a handsome example!

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  16. #9
    BPnet Veteran Gio's Avatar
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    Re: Gerald Super Dwarf Ultra Ivory Retic Progression

    Quote Originally Posted by Sauzo View Post
    All you guys with your starving feeding schedules!!! Feed the snakes!!! They are retics and they eat. Don't try and keep it small by underfeeding it!! Buy a male Hognose if you wanted a small snake!!! My god!!! And it's worth testing out his food drive. Caesar ate about 2 hours after being here and hasn't stopped lol.

    A 3.5' eating rat pups seems kind of small. I would imagine Bob had him on minimal feeding size and schedule as breeders want to keep them small as long as possible so they are easier to sell. Plus it cuts down on his overhead cost for food. At 3.5' Caesar was easily pounding small rats. Heck, Kris was feeding him small rats at just over 2' when I got him.

    Awesome snake though. Be interesting to see what yellowing and patterning he develops with age.
    Retics are still reptiles and reptiles have evolved over millions and millions of years to sustain themselves during long periods of famine. Just because something is a retic doesn't mean it is open season to give it endless food. JM and I SD x dwarf retics for a reason. They are smaller. They are from island populations that have seasonal peaks in feeding. Seasonal migration of certain bird species to those islands, mating and birth cycles of other mammals, rainy season, and other events play a role in their feeding and adult size.

    Though they are more active than the average boid, they are not made up the same way as some of the colubrids that actively forage.

    Feeding SD retics in theory should mimic their natural food cycles. They should have some prey variety, some variation in prey size and frequency and you as the keeper should observe their individual needs.

    It is well known and stated by more than a few experts that a male SD and dwarf retic can thrive and live a long healthy life by eating 1 large rat a week. Females may take a bit more, but if you are not breeding them, there is no need to stuff any snake unless you want it big.

    I'm doing just fine feeding my snake 1 small rat every 7-10 days and have had zero issues.

    JM,

    Find what the snake wants/needs and go from there but I'd always stay conservative.

    Gerald is a beauty!!

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  18. #10
    BPnet Veteran Sauzo's Avatar
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    Re: Gerald Super Dwarf Ultra Ivory Retic Progression

    Quote Originally Posted by CloudtheBoa View Post
    A SD retic will stay small no matter how you feed it, if you have to underfeed it to keep it small it's likely going to get bigger than you want.

    I'll have to disagree that the schedule Gerald was on was starving though. Not every snake is a hunger-crazed beast like Caesar, and they grow just fine being fed in that manner. Lol River was 3' even when I got her and I fed her rat pups until she was at least 4'. She grew 1.5' in 6 months eating that way, went from 3' at 6 months to 4.5' at a year. I did up her feeding through most of her second year, but ended up having to reduce the prey size as the bigger prey seemed to weigh her down. She easily took prey 15-25% of her weight as a baby, once she got on rabbits it had to be brought back down to 10-15%. Rats don't weigh her down as much but she does still get lazy the first few days on a colossal.


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    I agree the schedule Bob had him on with rat pups would work but you got to remember, those schedules are going to be on the minimum side as like I mentioned, they need to try and keep them as small as they can for as long as they can simply because its easier to sell a cute 3' snake than it is to sell a 12' monster. Also there is the overhead cost as breeders are going to have to deal with probably hundreds of animals and feeding that army on a more 'filling' diet is going to up the cost a lot. That's why you see breeders having these auctions and sales. They need to move the animals asap as every day its there, its costing them money plus they probably need rack room.

    And I agree also that not every animal is going to be the bottomless pit Caesar haha. You have to just learn how much food your animal needs and adjust. I mean all of our retics are a perfect example. On the more mannered side, we have Wallace and Riverrun who even when hungry, they are fairly placid. Then you have Phyllis and Caesar on the other end of the spectrum. They go bonkers and push, dig, climb, strike at stuff and even hurt themselves from pushing when they get hungry.

    I still think though that a 3.5' retic should be on small rats regardless though. If for no other reason than a small rat is going to offer more nutrition with developed bones, muscle and organs vs a pup who is still suckling on mom. And by all means, if you can keep him on a small rat every 10 days or even longer with him being placid, go for it. But I'm just saying don't feed the snake the bare minimum to keep it alive because you wanted a small snake. Not that JM is doing it or anyone here. I'm just saying it as a general statement everyone. That was the reason I was worried about getting a retic to begin with. I didn't want a huge snake but I also didn't want to have to feed it just enough to keep it alive and stunt it's growth just so I could say I have a retic.

    Also rats aren't as dense as rabbits. I mean when I feed Rosey rabbits, I usually tack on another week until the next feeding. I was planning on doing that with Caesar once he got on gpigs, rabbits or piglets. I figure those meals would give me a good 2 weeks between feedings before he got agitated and started being a menace to society lol. I'd love to do those 0.5lb piglets from Monster Feeders but their minimum order is 50lbs and I don't need 50lbs of piglets as I'm sure they would freezer burn or go bad before I got done with them.
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