Ippo's first meal in his new home

[hhw]

Well, I managed to get Ippo to eat with a little trouble:

I have three hide spots for him: On the warm side is a plastic container with a hole cut in the side; half of it is about 3.5 inches high while the other half is about 1.5 inches high. In the middle is an upside down ceramic pot base with a hole chipped out of it, and on the cool side is a potato salad container set on its side with a hole in the lid and some damp sphagnum moss inside.

According to the breeder where he came from, he will only take live at the moment but that I should try to get him onto P/K or F/T when I can. For acclimatization's sake, I thought it best to stick with live for the time being, so I brought back a live mouse today.

Ippo was hiding under the potbase in the middle. I think the opening was too small or something, because everytime he lunged at the mouse he missed, not coming out far enough. After a while, the mouse was getting scared and I thought it was cruel just to wait for this to go on and on. Ippo on the other hand wouldn't come out to go after the mouse either. I was worried that Ippo wouldn't strike if I removed him from his hiding spot but I decided to give it a try anyway as things were going nowhere. So, I took Ippo out into the open and set the mouse inside the box it came in inside the tank with the box opening facing Ippo. This time around, the mouse tried to make a break for it, Ippo got a clean strike, and that was that.

So, I have a few questions:
1) Do ball pythons generally only lie in wait of their prey, refusing to go after them or is Ippo still nervous in his new surroundings? He's been venturing out quite a bit the last few nights so I thought he'd be both comfortable and hungry by now. All the other snakes I've ever had have always stalked their prey so an ambush hunter is a little new to me.

2) How many more times should I feed live before trying to switch him to P/K? I imagine Ippo is somewhat finicky about dead prey or the breeder would've switched him already so I get the feeling this will be a difficult process and that I should make sure he is absolutely settled in before trying. (Ippo is already about 8 months old by the way, as you can see from my sig)

Anyway, putting the mouse into the tank while still inside its box seems to be a good idea to me; the mouse's smell will be nice and concentrated meanwhile alleviating any potential substrate swallowing problems. I think this is the way I'm going to go about it in the future; it will still allow Ippo to take the mouse ambush style and perhaps it will be easier for me to condition him into taking dead prey this way.

[gozetec02]

1) Ball Pythons in general are an ambush preditor. In other words they will lie in wait for thier prey to come to them. On the other hand they also seek out prey. So the answere is yes and no. What you should do is remove the hide he is hiding under and and dangle the PK mouse in front of him.

2) I would feed PK now instead of live. Never under any cirumstances should a live mouse be allowed alone in a cage with a Ball Python and some serious injury could result. Again i say kill the mouse and use some tongs to dangle the mouse by the tail in front of the ball python and he will strike it. If he doesn't dont press the issue just wait another week or till the next scheduled feeding. These snakes can go months without food. It also seems to me that the lunge was a defensive response.


Ok and about puting the mouse in tank while its still in the box is a bad, bad idea. When your ball python smells the mouse its feeding response turns on. So its in its cage and smells a mouse but don't see the mouse. Well eventually you will have to reach your and into the tank to retrieve the box that the mouse is in. When you do this the snake is looking for something warm to strike at and then it sees your hand. It thinks if it smells like a mouse it must be a mouse and BAMMM!!! he nails you. Now he might be little and may not even break the skin but they do have sharp little teeth that could get imbedded in your skin and they are a pain to remove. I know you know to wash your hands before and after you handle your snake. If smell like mouse then your a mouse get it. LOL

So try the FK right off the back. And do the mousey dance and Ippo should go for it. If he doesn't come back here and we can help more.

Happy herping.

[gen]

I agree, you should definitely try pre-killed next time. If he doesn't go for it at first, you could try dancin it around a bit to see if that helps. Feeding live is just too dangerous, I wouldn't risk it.

[hhw]

The box was placed with the opening (top of the box, flaps out) facing Ippo, so he could definitely see it.

I fed live this time, given Ippo's history as stated in my original post. I wanted to make sure that he was feeding at all, before trying to switch him over. I will try prekilled the next time for sure though, waiting a few extra days to make sure he's hungry. He's a pretty fat snake as it is. I realize ball pythons are a lot heavier bodied than the boas, rat snakes, and corn snakes I've had before, but I was still pretty amazed when I first got him! I've already found a place for carbon dioxide, so I should be all set to go for prekilled. I'll try to feed him the night before garbage day just in case he refuses it though ;P

Just one more question; ever since he's eaten he's more active than he's ever been so far... first 2 days the only time I saw him come out of hiding was once to defecate. The last two nights he's shuffled back and forth from hiding place to hiding place through the night, but hasn't been out in the open for extended periods like he is now. Is it normal for a ball python to be active after a meal? I would imagine he should be hiding up somewhere digesting his meal in privacy. I just want to be sure he's not having any digestions problems, which is unlikely given that the mouse I gave him (couldn't have been weaned too long ago) was a relatively small meal given Ippo's size. Could it be that the mouse was only enough to whet his appetite and that he's now looking for more?

[gen]

Could it be that the mouse was only enough to whet his appetite and that he's now looking for more?

I'm not an expert, so I don't really know, but it could be. How big is your ball python? Maybe you could be offering it larger prey. The prey size should be about the size of the biggest part of your snake's body.

[hhw]

Well, he's still nosing all around the aquarium. He's probably fine, probably just feeling a lot bolder with a little food in his gut. I haven't properly measured him yet, as the breeder suggested I not handle him until after he's fed. My best guess at this point is somewhere around 18-20inches? He could probably take a large adult mouse quite easily; I just decided to go with a smaller prey item this first time to make sure he had an easy time with it. I'll feed him something larger the next time...

This does give me an idea on how I might more effectively switch him to prekilled however, in case I can't get him to any other way... Instead of using 2 smaller prey items, with 1 mouse and 1 rat, I could try using 1 live and 1 prekilled mouse. Of course, this is just a contingency plan, I will try to get him straight to prekilled if possible.

I also found out today that one of my good friends, who's studying his masters in biology, throws away at least 20 or more each of carbon dioxide euthanized mice and rats each week... I could have a nice supply of freshly prekilled rodents every week. Too bad I'm not a breeder, lol.

[gozetec02]

Maybe he just likes cruising around. Ball pythons tend to be very curious about new suroundings. They will roam the cage just to see whats going on or if you pass by. When i see my ball pythons doing this they get a handling session for a little bit. I did that with Jojo since he was a baby and now it seems like when i walk by the cage he will come out as if saying "let me out". I dont know about you but ball pythons are the cutest things.

[Marla]

Sounds like you have a great source of prekilled prey ready for you, as long as they're not diseased that's great. It also sounds like you have a good plan for getting him switched. Good luck with the switch, you might have one of the easy ones.