Guidelines for toxic products?

[Marla]

OK, I know there is debate that pine, cedar, and redwood products may be toxic to reptiles and other small animals because of the phenols they contain. I also know it's not a good idea to go spraying industrial chemicals in or around a snake's enclosure because of the risk of toxicity. What I'd like to know, though, is whether there are any lists or guidelines regarding what products are safe for reptiles?

I've seen discussions involving custom enclosures (such as John's recent building adventures), where reference was made to using paints, sealants, and other potentially troublesome products. I've also seen some discussion of making terraforms with foam, spray paint, and sealants.

Have any of you used these types of products for creating enclosures or pieces to go within an enclosure? What steps have you taken to avoid poisoning your animals, if any (airing out >x hours, for example)? Have you had any bad results that could be ascribed to your use of chemicals (stargazing, lethargy, going off feed, etc.) and, if so, what chemicals had you used and how had you used them?

Thanks for any input you can give me.

[Ken]

Specifically, I'd like to know whether rubbing alcohol can be used to clean tanks (with the snakes out).

Thanks

[freakoverdose1]

speaking of harmful toxins...i am looking for an ethical way to kill and freeze the 28 mice i have that i had bred. Someone told me to soak a spong in ether and put the mice in a box with the sponge killing them instantly. Now, I could do this, but will this cause harm to the snake when he feeds on them?

[BallKingdom]

Dry ice would kill mice..

Sealents are ok to use most of the time so long as a week of airing our is given. This allows fumes to leave.

Cedar is toxic to reptiles, bad bad stuff. Some also agrue that pine dust and residue can be harmful.

[steelsack]

Far as I know, ether is a controlled substance and is hard to obtain. A rat in a bag against a post is pretty darn quick, though. But I understand how it can be hard to snuff a critter you've watched be born...........I raise rats, too. In the end I wack em in a bag. It's quick (just do it hard the first time or you might feel horrible!) and painless IMO as by the time the brain realizes something is wrong, it's already dead.

[Marla]

John, cedar, pine, and redwood all contain phenols, and there is ongoing debate as to whether they're actually harmful or not, but it's not as if cedar is bad and pine is okay. As far as I'm concerned, best practice says just avoid them. I'm curious regarding your source for the sealant info, and does it apply to all sealants or just particular types? Basically, I want to make some things for use in enclosures and want to know what materials to avoid altogether and what to use with specific safety precautions. Plus, I figure if we can accumulate a store of knowledge on this sort of thing, it will be useful to many herpers now and later.

[Mike]

ether...your joking right? haha.
put the mice in a cage or trashcan or something, put in some dry ice (blocked off so the mice cant get to it) let it let off some CO2 for a while. put in the mice with the co2 and seal the top. suran rap would work. they should all be dead in about a minute. i wouldnt want to have to take the time to wack 30 mice into a wall...
as for toxic stuff....i dont risk it. if it seems toxic, i dont get it near the snakes.

[Smynx]

Marla: There is a brand of paints, stains, sealers, etc. called "Safecoat" that is supposed to be non-toxic. There are a number of places online that sell the products. There is also a brand of all-purpose cleaners called SafeChoice that are non-toxic. If you use Google's shopping service, Froogle, you can find a number of places to buy the products. (I'm no stranger to research, either.)

[Marla]

Mike, I'm not talking about stuff that "seems toxic." I'm even allowed to cross the street by myself now. I am specifically thinking of items declared non-toxic for humans that have not been investigated for toxicity to reptiles, but others will have questions about other materials such as Ken's question about rubbing alcohol.

[Marla]

Smynx, thank you for that info. I'll have to look and see if I can find statements regarding toxicity to reptiles and/or other animals for those products. If you were about to use something like this and there were no published statements regarding toxicity to reptiles and the manufacturer would not make a statement either way, would you go ahead and use it, and if so, what precautions would you take?