?? on my new meican pine snake and bullsnake

[DutchHerp]

Oh man there's lots of papers on this subject! Stop trying to pretend to know a lot about this subject. First of all, rat snakes are not "most" colubrids. Second, garter snakes ARE venomous.

Later, Matt

[Skiploder]

Correct me if wrong but can you prove me that most colubrids like corns,rats,garters are venmous. Since Venmous snakes if not mistaken DO NOT constrict. I would love to see documented proof to prove me wrong that most colubrids are venomous.

Corns, rats, pits and kings are not venomous. Garters are. So are dispholidus, thrasops, thelatornis, rhabdophis, rhamphiophis, philodryas, telescopus, hydrodynastes, psammophis, boiga etc. etc. All colubrids. All produce venom. All documented.

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/04/05/science/05veno.html

Then go educate yourself. Dr. Fry has a wonderful website called Venomdoc with a forum and links to research papers (all free!) which document the fact that venomous colubrids are the rule - not the exception.

[Skiploder]

Oh man there's lots of papers on this subject! Stop trying to pretend to know a lot about this subject. First of all, rat snakes are not "most" colubrids. Second, garter snakes ARE venomous.

Later, Matt

[PyroPython]

I do agree. Just because YOU don't consider anything with venom to be a colubrid, doesn't make it right. Until it's scientifically altered, a hognose and the like will continue to be colubrids, despite your personal views.

[Skiploder]

Really, the majority of colubrids are non-venomous. Aside from Hognose and Boomslangs, and the northern cat-eyed snake (just a few to mention here), there really aren't too many that ARE venomous.

But I do agree. Just because YOU don't consider anything with venom to be a colubrid, doesn't make it right. Until it's scientifically altered, a hognose and the like will continue to be colubrids, despite your personal views.

In bold - wrong.

Most are. It's documented. Saying it isn't, does not make it so.

http://www.venomdoc.com/forums/viewt...ight=colubrids

If I may be allowed to quote form someone who has actually done research:

"Most colubrid snakes have very potent venom but produce very small amounts of it and typically have quite small rear fangs."

As for garters:

http://www.venomdoc.com/forums/viewt...light=sirtalis

Pay atterntion to WW's posts - that's Dr. Wolfgang Wuster.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wolfgang_W%C3%BCster

[RichsBallPythons]

I stand corrected then. I never owned anything that was considered venomous in colubrids. Only colubrid i owned when i had them were corns and kings, there for i never researched anything else, nor did anything pop out at me saying others were venomous.

[PyroPython]

Yeah, thats why I edited it. Mind is a little off today. My bad.

[monty's dad]

wow i had no idea... i handle garter snakes all the time in my backyard. should i stop doing that?

[PyroPython]

wow i had no idea... i handle garter snakes all the time in my backyard. should i stop doing that?

They won't kill ya.

[Skiploder]

Yeah, thats why I edited it. Mind is a little off today. My bad.