Caramel Female on Eggs??? Photo???

[Bill Buchman]

Dang!!!! Your girl looks to be good size. What is her age and ballpark ovulation weight. I am hoping that another gene will be with the Caramel female will solve the fertility problem -- IF there is one.

Congrats on the 2 eggs -- may they be girls.

[astaley]

Dang!!!! Your girl looks to be good size. What is her age and ballpark ovulation weight. I am hoping that another gene will be with the Caramel female will solve the fertility problem -- IF there is one.

Congrats on the 2 eggs -- may they be girls.

Thanks Bill. She is an 07 and her pre-ovulation shed weight was about 1800 g. She is a pos het ghost but I guess the chances of proving her are going to be kind of slim with two eggs.

Your caramel Mojos are awesome, what were the parents, and whats your experience with caramel females?

[Bill Buchman]

Thanks Bill. She is an 07 and her pre-ovulation shed weight was about 1800 g. She is a pos het ghost but I guess the chances of proving her are going to be kind of slim with two eggs.

Your Caramel Mojos are awesome, what were the parents, and whats your experience with caramel females?

Thanks!!! My next clutch of 7 eggs from a Ph Glow girl is due 9-5-09. I can't wait -- but I must.


All my Caramel Mojave clutches this year will be from Het Caramel girls. I currently have NO Caramel girls of any size. However, I won't hesitate to hold some back.

It is only a good thing that folks have become aware of Caramel fertility. Time/breedings will prove "yay or nay" as to whether there is "problem" with the Caramel girls. It does not make sense that there should be?? Genetic infertility is different in "kind" than kinking or spinning.

I feel that over the next 2-3 years Caramel females will prove to be no different than other morphs with regards to their fertility. But make no mistake -- I'll be watching!!!

[Serpent_Nirvana]

Time/breedings will prove "yay or nay" as to whether there is "problem" with the Caramel girls. It does not make sense that there should be?? Genetic infertility is different in "kind" than kinking or spinning.

Do you think so? I dunno ... I know nothing about the caramel morph aside from what I've read on the forums, but I think it is totally feasible that caramel females may have naturally lower fertility than other morphs. It could be that for whatever reason, their genetics dictates that they produce fewer ova per ovulation than the average female BP, the conformation of their oviduct may be somewhat off, or perhaps have a slightly less hospitable environment for sperm (too basic or too acid, or what have you) ... Who knows! (I sure don't -- it'll be a long dang time before I can afford a caramel female to prove it for myself )

If it does turn out to be the case that caramel females have low fertility, I don't think it'd be the end of the morph by a long shot -- it would just be another one of those morph "quirks" that breeders need to bear in mind, like not breeding albino to albino in boa morphs.

[Bill Buchman]

If it does turn out to be the case that caramel females have low fertility, I don't think it'd be the end of the morph by a long shot -- it would just be another one of those morph "quirks" that breeders need to bear in mind, like not breeding albino to albino in boa morphs.[/QUOTE]

Agreed!!! In fact, it might increase value of Caramel visuals and combos because you need to "creative" with pairings/projects because you can't count on the Caramel female being what would be considered "normally productive".

[jsmorphs2]

Agreed!!! In fact, it might increase value of Caramel visuals and combos because you need to "creative" with pairings/projects because you can't count on the Caramel female being what would be considered "normally productive".

Also agree, plus, there will be less caramels produced.

[Quality_Snakes]

my female (Bell line).

she's a '08 and was paired with a calico male

the clutch was composed by 3 fertile eggs and 4 slugs.

[Quality_Snakes]

ps 2 years ago a friend of mine got 5 good eggs from a caramel female (Bell line like mine) bred with a pastel and he got 1.1 pastel het caramel and 2.1 het caramels. gotta ask if he still has pics

[saskia]

From my friend Els from Ballpythons.nl .

only one egg shows good veigns.






I myself am waiting for a clutch from a PastelCaramel girl to a Pastel het. Caramel
male, I will show you when she has layed her clutch

[Serpent_Nirvana]

So, I'm a little bit of a nerd here.

Okay, more than a little bit.

I wanted to see what the actual numbers were, so I collected all of the clutch data that I could find to tally them up.

I included only clutches with numeric clutch data, provided by the breeder him or herself. I did not include photographs in which the exact number of eggs to slugs couldn't quite be quantified, and I did not include non-numeric anecdotes such as "I bred my caramel female last year and she slugged out," or "My buddy produced a good clutch from his caramel female."

Even using those inclusion criteria, I was surprised how many clutches I was able to tally. Here's what I have so far (I didn't write down whose clutch it was I tallied; should probably do that later to avoid future repetition ...):


Raw data

Clutch 1: 3 slugs, 2 eggs

Clutch 2: 4 slugs, 2 eggs

Clutch 3: 7 slugs, 2 eggs

Clutch 4: 5 slugs, 2 eggs

Clutch 5: 4 slugs, 1 eggs, 1 boob

Clutch 6: 7 slugs

Clutch 7: 6 slugs, 2 eggs

Clutch 8: 1 slug, 3 eggs

Clutch 9: 3 eggs

Clutch 10: 3 slugs, 1 boob

Clutch 11: 1 slug, 5 eggs


Total laid: 65

Total slugs: 41 (63%)

Total eggs: 22 (34%)

Total boobs: 2 (3%)


If you count the "boobs" as good eggs (since many are known to hatch), that bumps it up to 37% eggs, 63% slugs.

So, so far it looks like a little over 1/3 good, 2/3 slugs, with an average (or is it mean?) of two good eggs per clutch.

Please feel free to correct my math if you catch an error ...