Indiana Man Killed By 14ft Python

[Colin Vestrand]

well i'm a numbers guy so i'll just look on the bright side...

although tragic, this is one (of very few) instance of something bad happening among the thousands of large snake owners in the US. what is the percent of pet owning people that are killed by their pets? probably extremely small... and what percent of that percent is from large pythons and boas? again, probably extremely small.

its my opinion that there's really too much governing going on in all the wrong places. expanding govt and creating new laws and rules is just out of hand these days... everyone's trying to make everything too safe, whether its owning a snake or banning certain types of playground equipment. i could seriously list 100 things easily that have been banned, regulated, or at least tabooed by the government, or by systems motivated and ran by the government (media) just in my lifetime... and i'm only 24!

[shhhli]

But you can at least get a license. I'd have to call myself a zoo or a farm to keep my snake. I am neither a zoo nor a farm!

Just don't clean your house or something and fence in the dust bunnies. then you could apply for one or the other... ... or i could anyways...

[kerrynewman]

i hope i don't upset anybody, but i must say...all of these adjectives being used to describe a person who just lost his life ("idiot," "stupid," etc.) are very uncalled for. i know that nobody "means" to say hurtful things...and some weren't "specifically" calling this gentleman that, but it doesn't matter. this man was obviously of lover of reptiles. which means that quite possibly he had some friends and family that love them too. who's to say that one of them is not going to stumble across this post and be really hurt by some of the comments. yes, hindsight is ALWAYS 20/20, but at least have a little more respect for this person. the point is, a person is dead now. never coming back. it's good to debate about licensing, etc...but let's leave out all of the self-righteous comments. thanks.

[Slithers]

absolutely.

It is OBVIOUS he did not excercise proper handling techniques, even though it has been confirmed that he DID in fact know better. Him dieing as a result does not make him an "idiot" or anything else for that matter. He knew better and didnt play by the rules...that is a fact, but names calling is NOT necessary.

Friends of his are members of various msg boards, our thoughts, prayers, and condolensces should be with them and Patrick's family. again, RIP Patrick, let your death be a reminder to us all how important it is to practice responsible handling.

[Jeanne]

well i'm a numbers guy so i'll just look on the bright side...

although tragic, this is one (of very few) instance of something bad happening among the thousands of large snake owners in the US. what is the percent of pet owning people that are killed by their pets? probably extremely small... and what percent of that percent is from large pythons and boas? again, probably extremely small.

its my opinion that there's really too much governing going on in all the wrong places. expanding govt and creating new laws and rules is just out of hand these days... everyone's trying to make everything too safe, whether its owning a snake or banning certain types of playground equipment. i could seriously list 100 things easily that have been banned, regulated, or at least tabooed by the government, or by systems motivated and ran by the government (media) just in my lifetime... and i'm only 24!

I feel exactly the same, could not of said it better myself!

[Schlyne]

Having talked to some people who knew him well, it was very unusual for him to have gone in by himself. Unforunately, he paid the price for it.

As it is, a couple (who are experienced herpers) who knew him have adopted the rest of his reptiles and will be finding homes for them. They are also auctioning one of their boas to help out his family.

http://www.primareptilia.com/memorial.html

[Sapphire7]

Having talked to some people who knew him well, it was very unusual for him to have gone in by himself. Unforunately, he paid the price for it.

As it is, a couple (who are experienced herpers) who knew him have adopted the rest of his reptiles and will be finding homes for them. They are also auctioning one of their boas to help out his family.

http://www.primareptilia.com/memorial.html

I heard he rarely fed his snake.

[CTReptileRescue]

I heard he rarely fed his snake.

I can just imagine how many rumors are flying around about the recently deceased. Sadly these things happen....
Winslow and I have been working with some very large boids and varanids over the last 10 to 15 years. I just want to comment a bit about a few things in this thread.
On the issue of the gentleman who handled the snake by himself and sadly had his life taken because of this.
None of us were there. None of us know the situation. From what I have heard (and I cannot confirm this as I do not know him or his family) the man was an experienced reptile keeper. The golden rule in our house is Winslow and I know which snakes both of us have to be present for before opening the enclosure (and which monitors too). But the bottom line is there have been rare cases where I have been on my own and have had to handle large snakes. For instance I was out on a call with a local Animal Control Officer. Someone abandoned a 16 foot Reticulated python on a property owned by an elderly woman. We went out, I was able to bag the snake with only a minimal struggle. I was lucky. No one that was with me had any idea on how to handle a large snake let alone what to do in case of any trouble. That is just one instance. It happens, and I in no way would want someone telling me that i was an idiot for what I did. I could have been more prepared, but that is not always possible.
As for the legalities into owning a large snake.
I, running a rescue center, in no way would like to see more giant boids in the hands of folks who cannot care for them. But I do not agree with the government stepping in to enforce any laws about it. (some of you may be surprised by this) But the bottom line is that (at least here in this state) the government has absolutely no concept about large snakes and their care. The one enforcment agency in this state that would be in charge of this type of thing cannot even make up their own minds about what native species you can keep legally or not. The laws in this state are no more then written on a dry erase board and changed at any individuals whim.....
The laws are not clear and they are not comunicated correctly by any means. God forbid they were the ones whom would tell us if we were able to continue taking in these snakes.
In the end I think it comes down to individual ownership. People who are responsible and caring should be allowed to own these snakes at there will. That's their right. If I ran the world no one would ever be able to take something out of the wild and keep it in a box ever again, but I do not run the world.
I think the best we can do is promote captive breeding programs for those species whose numbers are being devistated in the wild, and becoming the most responsible pet owners we can be. Educate others and never stop learning ourselves.
Rusty

[morti]

Sorry to dredge up such a very old thread, but it has been almost a year since Patrick died, and I made a promise to his dad to educate in his name. I think that, as we approach the anniversary of his death, it is a good time to have a bit of a reminder of why it is important to always respect giant snakes and handle them safely.

For those of you who don't know me very well yet, I'm Donnie Smith, owner of PrimaReptilia and until recently I was an officer in the Kentucky Herp Society. Since there is a lot of speculation about exactly what happened and why, I'd like to clarify a little bit.

The Von Allmen family have been very active members of the Herp Society for several years. My wife and I became good friends with the family. When Patrick started getting into retics, we cautioned him on Several occasions to take every precaution with them and never handle them alone. He really did know better. The first thing his older brother Craig said to me at the funeral home was "He was being stupid".

The best we can piece together (since no one else was there) is that he took the snake out, restrained her head, and began treating her mouth. She must have spazzed out and tightened down on him, just simply because she was not comfortable. There was not a bite mark on him and we all know that Retics have Big Teeth. That would have been found. He did have a wound on the back of his head that would most likely been caused by hitting his head as he fell, but the coroner's report stated that the actually cause of death was "consistent with asphyxiation due to compression about the neck and chest."

The other thing I wanted to clarify is the size of the snake. The media grossly overestimated the length. She was actually approximately 11'.



That picture was taken on 9/11/06... roughly a week after Patrick died on the day that I took possession of the snake.

The following link is almost required reading. It is one of the better news reports as well as a letter from Patrick's Mom.

Patrick Von Allmen Tribute Page

So Patrick, we miss you buddy. Your babies are doing good.

[xdeus]

Thanks for providing an update, Donnie. That was a very unfortunate death and I feel bad for everyone involved.

I think it's important for those in the hobby to realize that even though the media blows these incidents out of proportion, these creatures still demand the utmost respect. Frankly I'm amazed at the size of the retic. I would never have guessed that a snake of that size would be capable of overpowering a full grown man, and hopefully those with giants will read this and be vigilant in taking all appropriate precautions in handling these snakes.