Wanting to start breeding ASF

[ian.nesmith]

I recently ordered a Large Rodent Breeding Tub from Reptile Basics and will be getting it soon. I would like to give ASF a shot, but I have a TON of questions.


I don't particularly want a huge operation. I have 10 ball pythons, nothing very serious. But I want to breed them for the experience and for the money side of it.


I wanted to get two females, and one male. Is this possible? I planned on buying a large sterilite tub for a "Grow out tub" for all the babies that I plan on growing out to feed or freeze. Is this possible? Maybe somebody can point me in the right direction to a link of how to do a small operation breeding project? When do I take the babies out? Do I ever have to introduce new males or do I let a baby grow up and take over? How doe this whole situation work?

[bivman]

I've bred ASFs for 4 years. You will need 2 colonies to support 10 BP. I'd do 2 1.4's if it was me. Also you will need 2 grow out tubs, one for males and one for females. Ask away if you have any other questions, I've seen it all.

Brian

[ian.nesmith]

I've bred ASFs for 4 years. You will need 2 colonies to support 10 BP. I'd do 2 1.4's if it was me. Also you will need 2 grow out tubs, one for males and one for females. Ask away if you have any other questions, I've seen it all.

Brian

So, two breeding tubs, 1 male, 4 females in each. As babies are born I separate them into two separate big tubs for grow out, one for males one for females. How long can I expect the 1.4 last as far as breeding goes? When/if they die, how do I replace them? With a baby from the grow out tub? Is breeding ASF going to be more difficult than Norways? My coworker breeds norways and says I'm going to have a really hard time. Any tips you can throw my way I would greatly appreciate it.

[BCS]

To be very honest with you, ASFs are not as good as mice. I had four colonies of ASFs and two mice colonie. It takes ASFs 4 months to get full grown and big enough for one to feed a small adult. Mice grow in less then a month produce more and faster and have less cannibalism within the litters.

I am not trying to persuade you of course. ASFs when fully grown, a large adult BP could take up to two where for mice a BP would take up to four adults. But I personally have more success with mice then I do ASFs. Since ASFs grow slower, you may find yourself feeding them faster then you can produce them. I had 19 BPs, 4 colonies of ASFs (3.1 ratio) and still had to buy feeders from other sources. With the mice (3.1 ratio), I never have to buy from an outside source and that is with just two colonies of mice.

Reintroducing males to females with ASFs is extremely difficult. I had never had success with pulling out a male and reintroducing him. The females will kill him. I no longer separate my males from my females, unfortunately this gives the females a short life span, but once you take out the male, you lose a colony anyway. Some people have success with this, I never once have.

You separate the babies from the mothers at 21 days old. At this time they will be fully weaned and eating on their own, plus a females gestation is 21 days so by the time you are pulling out the 21 day old babies, the mother may have already given birth to a new litter. If you still see them suckling at this age (which I highly doubt) you can keep them in there longer but it's not necessary. Separating the sibling females from the sibling males is also a good idea.

If for some reason the male or a female dies, keeping one to grow up to breed with the parent is no issue. But don't let it become a chain. I only do this with one generation if I absolutely have to. Usually by that time though, I already have a new colony to replace the old colony. Since it takes about 5-6 months for ASFs to reach sexual maturity, the old colony gets fed off while the new younger colony takes their place. Sounds harsh and kind of sad I know, but it is a good way to keep colonies breeding faster and fuller for you. As a female gets older, they produce smaller litters. This is very much the same with mice, and typically my mice colonies last less then my ASFs, but that is only because my mice colonies grow up faster. At three months old a new younger mice colony replaces the older colony.

Make sure you feed them well. Remember, these guys are going to be fed to your snakes. The healthier your feeders are, the healthier your snakes will be. Breeding feeders (when you have a large collection of snakes) is a lot cheaper then buying them from a store and usually healthier if you are willing to put in the extra effort, time and money. It costs me $235 a month to feed my collection when not breeding my own feeders. Since breeding feeders, it now costs me about $300 a year! That is a BIG difference. But like I said, healthy feeders, healthy snakes.

Many feeder breeders usually just feed rodent lab blocks. They need more then that. The need meat protein like cooked chicken or scrambled eggs and even canned meal worms or crickets. The need fresh fruits and veggies. Apples, bananas, green leaf lettuce, spinach, broccoli, carrots, peas, etc. All small rodents LOVE bird millet seed! You should also provide them with a mineral block/wheel which can be purchased bulk at any pet store for $0.99 a piece and they last for a long time. I usually buy $10 worth and chop them into smaller chunks. This last for at least 6 months or more.

This works for both ASFs and mice. I still suggest you give both options (mice and ASFs) a try and see which one you like more. Whether mice or ASFs are more nutritious for snakes, I do not know but my snakes are mostly fed mice and they are huge, healthy and seem to be happy. Hope this helps and good luck.

[bivman]

Yes that's what I would do. The breeders will last almost a year, until the output drops. Yes, you can replace with babies. I never did Norways, but ASFs grow slower. When they are breeding, they get nasty. Ive been bitten to the bone before, its no fun. They smell way less, about the same as Gerbils. Watch what you feed them Mazuri lab block works best. They will eat the babies if the fat content is off. Sometimes they will eat the babies or turn on each other for no reason. Ball Pythons love em, and the size is good. You can always feed your big females 2 if need be. Watch for chew outs, give them a small block of wood to chew on. A wheel will also keep them busy.Let me know if I forgot anything.

Brian

[ian.nesmith]

Thanks a lot yall, I think after reading through all of this I've decided to just raise Norways!

[chilliscale]

From people experience is it really hard to get your balls from asf to rats or is it similar to having a "mouser" in your collection where it just depends on the animal