Questions about PVC Caging

[ibbu]

I've been interested in purchasing a PVC cage for my female BP. I'm having trouble in deciding which company to order from. I think I've narrowed it down to PVCCages (48Lx24Dx18H) or Animal Plastics (T8, same dimensions), but still open to all possibilities. I was hoping someone could point me in the right direction.

I have her staying in my basement. The room temperatures during the summer in the basement range from 70-80, generally between 74-78. I am not sure what it will be like in the winter; I live in Toronto. I know basements feel cooler in the summer and warmer in the winter, but I'm not sure if it's just relative to upstairs or an actual change. If someone knows better, please let me know.

I've read a fellow member's guide about PVC cages and the various heating methods. I understand flexwatts would play the role of belly heat, but have seen conflicting views on RHP - whether they actually increase ambient or not. If not, I could use a CHE to increase the ambient, but would need a PVC cage that grants me that option. I've also read that using a fluorescent light in the tank would sufficiently increase ambient temps.

Lastly, I was unable to find whether these companies ship to Canada, and if they have ridiculous shipping fees or not.

I think I've included all the necessary information. Any input would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

[I-KandyReptiles]

Check out Cornels World. He lives in Calgary, Alberta
http://www.cornelsworld.com

I got my PVC cage from him and it's wonderful! He's also very quick to answer questions.

I've messaged animal plastics about their t8, and shipping would be over $100!

Edited to fix URL link

[kitedemon]

I have shipped a vision to canada and would not do that again. There are a number of great cages made here and there is no point to paying the shipping and high brokerage fees unless necessary. Greg West is a great guy (Cornell's world) Sly Plastics is also great (web site sucks however) http://www.slyplastics.com. A friend of mine has a PowerHouse cage and it is also quite good better IMO than AP a really well thought out design. http://powerhousedisplays.weebly.com/products.html

Radiant heat panels are great things, I own two. THEY do NOT heat air however (look up RADIANT...) don't take my word for it read the FAQ from one of the biggest manufacturers of them, reptile basics. RHPs can be used to replace UTHs but like UTH do little for ambient air temps.

"...This Infrared Heat tends to heat objects more than the air, much like the natural sunlight outdoors."

http://www.reptilebasics.com/radiant-panel-faq

Where the idea of a radiant heat panel heating air comes from I don't know, the only explanation is holding a thermometer under it (heating the thermometer) to check air temps (it must be beside it...) this shows a complete lack of understanding of the nature of the product and of the way things heat.

Fun little web explanations ... http://www.wisc-online.com/Objects/V...aspx?ID=sce304


It does not alter ambient air temps much but instead replaces the need of flexwatt. If the room is cool a convection source is still needed they luckily are cheap and easy. Fluorescent lights act almost the same way as a RHP only it is a convection source I use a deep blue (reptiles 'see' deep into IR and less in UV so blue is better than red as red is in the visual range.) LED lights during the night the led emits little heat but the electronics around them do. I measure my FL lights at around 100ºF (maxed, lower than the 160ºF of a RHP) and the blue led lights at 90ºF this helps act as a heat pump to run a more aggressive ventilation system and increase the ambient air temps. I easily hold 12-17 degrees over background. (65º room and I get air temps in between 77-82º) in the summer I have the lights shut down longer periods of time and often during the hottest (brightest part of the day) I don't think the snakes even notice as it is during the sleep cycle for them.

[VooDooDoc]

Other than cost, the thing keeping me from going with a PVC cage is how to get the ambient temps up. Is there any realistic way, other than making the whole room hotter? What about just hanging heat lamps overtop of the cage? Would the heat penetrate to warm up the air inside?

[I-KandyReptiles]

My room gets to about 65.

I have an RHP and flexwatt and have found it's easy to keep an ambient of at least 80. :/

[The Serpent Merchant]

Other than cost, the thing keeping me from going with a PVC cage is how to get the ambient temps up. Is there any realistic way, other than making the whole room hotter? What about just hanging heat lamps overtop of the cage? Would the heat penetrate to warm up the air inside?

PVC cages are extremely well insulated, You absolutely don't need to heat an entire room for them. The air temperature of the room doesn't affect them all that much. (especially when compared to tubs) You can use a radiant heat panel to help, as well fluorescent lights. Some PVC cage manufactures will put screens in the roof of the cage for heat lamps (animal plastics does this)

[VooDooDoc]

PVC cages are extremely well insulated, You absolutely don't need to heat an entire room for them. The air temperature of the room doesn't affect them all that much. (especially when compared to tubs) You can use a radiant heat panel to help, as well fluorescent lights. Some PVC cage manufactures will put screens in the roof of the cage for heat lamps (animal plastics does this)

If you put screens in the roof of the cage, doesn't that just let all the humidity out? I guess if you set the light right on it maybe that would be ok. Those things get damn hot though, I'd be worried about the metal screen getting too hot and burning my snake. Is that just paranoia? I currently keep my lights suspended a few inches off the metal screen on my tank.

Maybe I'm just confused on how well a RHP will heat the cage. I was under the impression that it would create a good hot spot, but do nothing to keep air temps up throughout the cage. Then again I see people put these in the middle of the cage, would think it should be on one side if that was the case. Animal plastics has the T8 on sale now for $150, maybe I'll have to look into it. Now I just gotta find something to put in this ExoTerra tank, can't just have an empty tank sitting around.

[Tfpets]

In an insulated structure such as a PVC cage, a RHP or UTH by itself will not heat the air. But they will heat objects such as the cage itself, the substrate or a hide. Those objects will get warm and heat the air. When used in a glass aquarium this heat is easily lost, but in a PVC cage it stays. You actually have to be careful not to let the ambient temp get too high in some cases. I have opened the doors on my vision tanks on cool mornings and felt the heat and humidity come pouring out of the open door! It is amazing how well insulated they are!

[VooDooDoc]

If I have a room that is 68 degrees. Will a RHP in say a T8 from Animal Plastics be sufficient as the only heat source or not? What about the 11" flexwatt?

[Tfpets]

Don't know for sure, it's kind of a case by case scenario. My house gets as low as 58-60 in the winter at times. I seem to be able to keep happy, healthy snakes in my vision tanks. The vast majority of my collection is in racks in a separate heated room, but I have a few in the main living area in vision tanks. I use UTH pads, heat cable and lots of foil/bubble wrap insulation in varying scenarios and don't have any issues. With the heat cable routed up and down the back and covered with the foil/bubble wrap insulation it really seems to help keep the temps up. I just set it up so the temperature gradient is from front to back rather than side to side. That way the glass doors act as a naturally cooler spot.